interesting post on femme identity

[snugglekitty]

Mistress Matisse, whose writing I really like, posted this in response to a letter from a reader.

I found it interesting. I'm part of a group called madfemmepride, which I recommend to anyone that might be inclined to join it - it really is mad friendly, just as advertised. We've had some discussions about what it means to be femme, and MM's post reminded me of those - perspectives on femme that had never occurred to me. (For instance, it has never occurred to me to think that straight women shouldn't be able to claim femme identity. I think it can still be meaningful and respectful.) As I was commenting in my previous post on femme identity, I think the crucial element is of choice, but not everybody sees it that way.

Comments

an unexpected attack of verbosity

[tsuj.livejournal.com]

I went to read Mistress Matisse's blog. MM writes, "If you're a straight woman who wears girly clothes and looks/acts in ways that generally line up with societal norms, you don't need a special word to describe your presentation and emphasize that you're doing it on purpose."

But couldn't we consider those straight women to be in a form of 'drag'?

Lipstick, pointy high heeled shoes,18th century wire construction high wigs, a corset and bustle, or whatever is currently considered 'the height of fashion' are all societal constructs of what is considered 'feminine'. They are costumes of a sort.

I don't begrudge 'straighties' the use of the term "femme." Dressing 'girly' is a societal norm that pressures women and girls to look and act in a particular way, regardless of whether or not it feels right to them. Using the term 'femme' can be a way to thumb noses at such potentially oppressive expectations, while reserving the right to freely explore self-expressions.
Unfortunately, we live in a world of labels. People should at least be able to choose their own. :)

As my favorite bumper sticker states: "Subvert the dominant paradigm"

*wonders what the heck was in that imported chocolate I just ate*

Re: an unexpected attack of verbosity

[lady-anemone.livejournal.com]

Great comment, thank you. I agree with you - gender is performative. Femininity and masculinity are both social constructs. A hundred years ago, pink was considered a masculine color and blue a feminine one. We make meaning, so why not at least make things mean what we want them to mean?

I have no problem with en-clued straight women calling themselves femme, or guys calling themselves femme, for that matter. I feel that words like "femme" and "butch" emphasize gender choice and identity over gender dualism and policing, at least when used as self-identifying terms, and I think that's a good thing.
It's when we start telling other people what they should label themselves as that we have problems, just as you suggest. I suspect that the reader whose letter was mocked mercilessly by MM would not see me as a femme - he seems to be looking for something out of a movie. And I feel very confident that he is not simply looking for someone who self-identifies as a femme - I doubt he asked all those "butch-looking" women how they labelled themselves! He has a picture in his head of what a femme should look like, and that's what he's after. Nevertheless, good luck to him, whoever he is. The world needs more femme appreciators who have at least enough wit to use the word.

[bluepapercup]

God damn her post made my cranky get up!

I'm going to repeat some things that tsuj said, I think, but not exactly.

I find it offensive that she thinks "straight girls" can't use the word femme. In my mind, there's two things going on - your biological bits and your presentation. Just because you have woman bits and are only attracted to men bits doesn't mean that you automatically present as "feminine". As always, there's a range. Some straight women prefer hiking boots, jeans, and always have a pocketknife on them. Is that butch? Or it just a straight girl pretending to be butch because we all know that under her fleece she's wearing a lace bra because she's SOOO STRAIGHT! Right? Right.

I think it's actually extremely useful for straight women to be able to apply words like "butch" and "femme" to themselves. I agree with tsuj's saying that the notion of "girly" is the societal norm. It SO is. So the conscious choice to present as very "girly" or not is important - because it comes with the implication that there was self-determination involved in that presentation. I think that if we have to deal with people who like labels, having access to as many labels as possible helps people describe themselves more fully. Otherwise, we're stuck with word like "tomboy", which has lots of connotations that are frankly outdated, not to mention it has the word "boy" in it - and most straight women don't self-identify with boys, in my experience.

Anyway. I think MM gets up on her high horse a little too often, and tends to think she's the arbiter of all that is queer and kinky just because she's been a professional long enough that she can afford designer dresses.

And as always - where the fuck does this leave bi women? *sigh*

[lady-anemone.livejournal.com]

In my mind, there's two things going on - your biological bits and your presentation.

Actually, I think there are three things going on - your biological bits, your gender presentation, and your sexual orientation. They don't have to coincide, although they seem to for a lot of people.

And as always - where the fuck does this leave bi women? *sigh*

I agree, and I found it interesting that MM didn't make any comment about that - the reader broke the world up into gay and straight, and she kind of let him. Although I do wish that guys would let the queer girls come to them, as she suggests at the end of her post. I get approached by so many straight men online that it gets kind of annoying.

Plus, I've definitely known queer women who were unenlightened about gender expression possibilities. I think those kinds of broad, sweeping generalizations are bad. And look, I just made one myself! I'm so witty.

[notpiecebypiece.livejournal.com]

I don't get why straight people have to be included in everything. I get that femme means different things to different people, but the queer community had to work really hard to construct words and definitions and ways of functioning with each other outside of heteronormativity (which is where femme falls for me -- as a word used by queer people to understand other queer people). and yes, yes, you can be anti-heteronormativity even when you're straight, of course, but I dunno, does being anti-racist make it okay to start picking up black cultural norms? if you're aware that your gender performance is a construct, that's great, but I don't certainly blame queer people for wanting words of their own to apply to their own community.